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  #21  
Unread October 21st, 2017, 03:13 PM
picknpluck picknpluck is offline
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The J and the S had the same RIO panel AFAIK
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  #22  
Unread October 21st, 2017, 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted by picknpluck View Post
The J and the S had the same RIO panel AFAIK
According to the ZM concept notes, which have schematics of both the J and S pits, front and back, they are showing them being very different. Now I'm really confused and at this point I'm going to stop work on the cockpit until I can get this sorted out......Dave Roof I need your help!
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  #23  
Unread October 21st, 2017, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by ORANGF15Guy View Post
According to the ZM concept notes, which have schematics of both the J and S pits, front and back, they are showing them being very different. Now I'm really confused and at this point I'm going to stop work on the cockpit until I can get this sorted out......Dave Roof I need your help!
Ok Fellas,
Been doing some research to try to find out what rear IP should be used on my build......and this is what I've found:

Aircraft 153071 through 158354 have the IP panel that the ZM kit recommends for the F-4J. The serial number of Showtime 100 was 155800

Aircraft 158355 and up have the IP panel that the ZM kit recommends for the F-4S. This IP panel is included in the ZM kit.

So I think I've got the right IP panel according to the site I visited. The site also has schematics for both the front and rear IP's and shows the difference.
Here is the website that I visited:
http://aviation.watergeek.eu/f4j-panel.html

Let me know if I'm headed in the right direction.
Thanks
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  #24  
Unread October 21st, 2017, 10:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ORANGF15Guy View Post
Ok Fellas,
Been doing some research to try to find out what rear IP should be used on my build......and this is what I've found:

Aircraft 153071 through 158354 have the IP panel that the ZM kit recommends for the F-4J. The serial number of Showtime 100 was 155800

Aircraft 158355 and up have the IP panel that the ZM kit recommends for the F-4S. This IP panel is included in the ZM kit.

So I think I've got the right IP panel according to the site I visited. The site also has schematics for both the front and rear IP's and shows the difference.
Here is the website that I visited:
http://aviation.watergeek.eu/f4j-panel.html

Let me know if I'm headed in the right direction.
Thanks
Good deal Brad. I just ordered FB's "Black Bunny" set and that jet is 153783.
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  #25  
Unread October 21st, 2017, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by f-15ERJ145 View Post
Good deal Brad. I just ordered FB's "Black Bunny" set and that jet is 153783.
You're gonna really like this kit.....it's not perfect, but it's been a really fun build so far! I just went out and visited the Furball site and saw the Black Bunny sheet, should be great to work with! Can't wait to see it Chris!
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  #26  
Unread November 11th, 2017, 06:16 PM
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Well she starting to look like a Phantom......pit and the engines are in, bottom and top fuselage are sealed up and the front and mid glass is in. Have all of my putty seams checked for correctness so I should be putting paint on this really soon.







I uses some colored resin that is translucent for the navigation lights. I've used them on some of my F-15 builds and I think they look much better than painting them on. Once I get them shinned up with a coat of clear.







Also got some work done on the canopies. I used the Hypersonic Models Canopy Details set. This set was designed for the Hasegawa kits, but after some measuring and some very careful cutting I was able to make everything fit.





That's it for now. I hope to get some paint on this beast and starting working on some of the flaps, slats and gear doors for my next post.
Thanks for looking.
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  #27  
Unread November 12th, 2017, 09:46 PM
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The RIOs IP the OP used is correct for 5800. Earlier J models had a hybrid sort of rear panels. They had the upper panels similar to the B model yet the port radar tuning/test breaker & lower, forward panel as the later J/S types & the radar scope was for the J after AN/AGW-10/B radars were retrofitted to the original lead nose Js (they were initially delivered without radars or ECM suites in '67) & later ones coming off the line in St. Louis that received them similar to the S. The RIO also had the radar scope "joy stick" in the same location as the B/N on the starboard side. Later block Js & earlier retrofits had an almost identical cockpit setup as the S. Further I don't recall 5800 as having kills on the port splitter plate prior to the 10 May '72 sortie & it never made it back to the boat after its historic triple Mig kill mission to have any Mig kill markings applied anyway. Can anyone clarify this? I apologize in advance if I'm incorrect.

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Last edited by MSgt; November 17th, 2017 at 03:32 PM.
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  #28  
Unread November 13th, 2017, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
The RIOs IP the OP used is correct for 5800. Earlier J models had a hybrid sort of rear panels. They had the upper panels similar to the B model yet the port radar tuning/test breaker & lower, forward panel as the later J/S types & the radar scope was for the J after AN/AGW-10/B radars were retrofitted to the original lead nose Js & later ones coming off the line in St. Louis that received them similar to the S. The RIO also had the radar scope "joy stick" in the same location as the B/N on the starboard side. Later block Js & earlier retrofits had an almost identical cockpit setup as the S. Further I don't recall 5800 as having kills prior to the 10 May '72 sortie & it never made it back to the boat to have any Mig kill markings applied. Can anyone clarify this? I apologize in advance if I'm incorrect.

S/F,
Masterguns
Thanks for the feedback Gunny, I really appreciate it. After I decided to do Showtime 100 I started to see a lot of different opinions about wether 5800 had the MiG Kill markings or not. And after that I ran across Matt Waki's print and his research showed that 5800 did not have the MiG-21 silhouette painted in the black tri-angle on the vertical stab. Instead he was saying that it had two NVA flag "kill Markings" on the port side splitter plate instead. He also explains what the correct loadout should be.
I'm glad I ran across this print, because there are very conflicted points of view about the markings and loadout!
Thanks again for your help and service to our country!
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  #29  
Unread November 13th, 2017, 08:01 PM
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Did you order their C/D yet?
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  #30  
Unread November 14th, 2017, 09:03 AM
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Hey Chris,
Not yet but I'm going to order a couple of them when I do.....waiting for year end bonus!
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  #31  
Unread February 13th, 2018, 11:51 AM
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Looking spectacular
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  #32  
Unread April 15th, 2018, 03:25 PM
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Been away from this build for a while due to life stuff, but I'm back at it. Started to work on the bare metal areas and nozzles....
Should look more convincing as soon as I get a black wash on these areas.






Also in doing some research on the J, It looks like when the hydraulic pressure starts to bleed off the main leading edge flaps droop, and so the the outer leading edge flaps. Unfortunately ZM molded these flaps in the up position so I purchased the Wolfpack after market set so I could show them both in the correct position. Cut out the molded in parts flaps and showing them mocked up!




That's it for now, should be starting on the painting the jet soon!
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Last edited by ORANGF15Guy; April 15th, 2018 at 03:30 PM.
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  #33  
Unread April 15th, 2018, 03:56 PM
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Brad,

In a normal shut down only the aileron (and sometimes the hoizontal stabs) would droop as far as control surfaces were concerned. The leading edge & trailing edge flap would only droop if the pilot left that way before shut down or if the maintenance crew had to let them down for an involved maintenance. Or, unless I missed something that you're depicting for the actual bird you're recreating. Outstanding work so far, hardcharger!!!

S/F,
Masterguns
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Last edited by MSgt; April 15th, 2018 at 03:58 PM.
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  #34  
Unread April 15th, 2018, 07:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
Brad,

In a normal shut down only the aileron (and sometimes the hoizontal stabs) would droop as far as control surfaces were concerned. The leading edge & trailing edge flap would only droop if the pilot left that way before shut down or if the maintenance crew had to let them down for an involved maintenance. Or, unless I missed something that you're depicting for the actual bird you're recreating. Outstanding work so far, hardcharger!!!

S/F,
Masterguns
Hey Gunny,
Thanks for the feedback......My thought was to try to show "some movement" on the control surfaces, so the model didn't look static!
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  #35  
Unread April 18th, 2018, 09:32 AM
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Wow:

Lookin pretty sweet in here! Keep up the great work...

Stephen C.
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  #36  
Unread April 18th, 2018, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by intruder500 View Post
Wow:

Lookin pretty sweet in here! Keep up the great work...

Stephen C.
"Spaz"
Intruder500
Thank you Sir!
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  #37  
Unread April 19th, 2018, 11:08 AM
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Brad,
Great work so far! All these new phantoms coming out it's hard to lay off. The $90-ish price tag on the ZM kits has kept me away so far. Maybe when they do their late D version I'll pull the trigger. Until then I'll keep watching you!! Can't wait to see more!
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  #38  
Unread April 19th, 2018, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ORANGF15Guy View Post
Hey Gunny,
Thanks for the feedback......My thought was to try to show "some movement" on the control surfaces, so the model didn't look static!
No worries. I undastan'! You're good, brah! I wasn't tryig to build your model for you. I was just speaking outta my arse more or less about historical accuracy with how Phantoms wing control surfaces are "usually" seen deployed at the leaning rest on the apron. BU, of course there are all kinds of postions they've been set after ahut down for one reason or another whether it be for maintence, malfunction (gremlins), test, etc. I didn't know if that's what you were going for so I took the op & made the statement about how the control surfaces are seen after the F-4 is shut down with all the flaps still set in the landing config. Since you mentioned you want a less static appearance.....

One positive with the ZM kit is you can drop (with no surgery) the center & outboard leading edge flaps as you've already planned. Droop the aileron & finish it off by lowering the trailing edge flaps for ideal landing deflection/degree settings. Slant dem stabs, too. I enjoy looking at these pics. You're doing an outstanding job with construction & thought out research. I've loved Phantoms since my first clear memories as a young toddler when my pa flew them. He would bring me to the hanger on the weekend sometimes when he was home & show me around this this seemingly mammoth like beast. I was obsessed. He flew the Phantom for over two decades among other fast jets before he retired. Keep humping til this thing done, brah!

S/F,
Masterguns

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Last edited by MSgt; April 19th, 2018 at 03:22 PM.
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  #39  
Unread April 19th, 2018, 08:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
No worries. I undastan'! You're good, brah! I wasn't tryig to build your model for you. I was just speaking outta my arse more or less about historical accuracy with how Phantoms wing control surfaces are "usually" seen deployed at the leaning rest on the apron. BU, of course there are all kinds of postions they've been set after ahut down for one reason or another whether it be for maintence, malfunction (gremlins), test, etc. I didn't know if that's what you were going for so I took the op & made the statement about how the control surfaces are seen after the F-4 is shut down with all the flaps still set in the landing config. Since you mentioned you want a less static appearance.....

One positive with the ZM kit is you can drop (with no surgery) the center & outboard leading edge flaps as you've already planned. Droop the aileron & finish it off by lowering the trailing edge flaps for ideal landing deflection/degree settings. Slant dem stabs, too. I enjoy looking at these pics. You're doing an outstanding job with construction & thought out research. I've loved Phantoms since my first clear memories as a young toddler when my pa flew them. He would bring me to the hanger on the weekend sometimes when he was home & show me around this this seemingly mammoth like beast. I was obsessed. He flew the Phantom for over two decades among other fast jets before he retired. Keep humping til this thing done, brah!

S/F,
Masterguns

Thanks Gunny!
Feel free to give me all the feed back you want. I have several friends that flew
The Rhino with the Oregon Air Guard out of Portland and Klamath Falls both.
I met these guys back in the early 90's when I was the Military Accounts Rep for Coors Brewing Company. They asked me if I wanted to sponsor "Sentry Eagle" at Kingsley Field in Klamath Falls and "Beaver Hunt" at Portland. Did both......several in Portland and over 22 years at Kingsley Field. Was around so much the started calling me "Pete" because I was the Coors guy. Had the absolute honor of flying on 8 or 9 refueling missions with them during the Sentry Eagle Air to Air exercises and they finally took me up in an F-15! 16 September, 2000 was a day I will never forget! Turned me every which way but loose, but man what a ride!
I left the brewery, but still get calls from some of the guys asking me to come for the airshow or just to hang out!
So most of my experience is being around Air Force aircraft, so if you see me do anything stupid, sound off!! I'm not the best model builder, but what I do build I try to make it as accurate as possible!
Thanks,
Brad
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Last edited by ORANGF15Guy; June 19th, 2018 at 06:02 PM.
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